tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post7894629280475149824..comments2023-03-21T05:49:21.694-04:00Comments on Seeking Avalon: Can't Fall From The GutterAvalon's Willowhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07539301720154191607noreply@blogger.comBlogger20125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-112119373896166202009-03-07T14:48:00.000-05:002009-03-07T14:48:00.000-05:00Mallory:You make a comment about growing racism an...<STRONG>Mallory:</STRONG><BR/><BR/>You make a comment about growing racism and describing what's been going on as a war and you expected it to get posted?<BR/><BR/>Be gone and do not darken my virtual doorway again.Avalon's Willowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07539301720154191607noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-37259493004608792262009-03-07T13:52:00.000-05:002009-03-07T13:52:00.000-05:00Wow! My comment never posted.Why?Wow! <BR/><BR/>My comment never posted.<BR/><BR/>Why?Malloryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05215387545514038881noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-22257586325884395002009-03-06T17:43:00.000-05:002009-03-06T17:43:00.000-05:00Avalon's Willow:I assume people have feet of clay....<B>Avalon's Willow:</B><BR/><BR/>I assume people have feet of clay. I know my own well enough. :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-90743991913907135522009-03-06T02:16:00.000-05:002009-03-06T02:16:00.000-05:00Delux:...<STRONG>Delux:</STRONG><BR/>...Avalon's Willowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07539301720154191607noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-17772166931052691412009-03-06T01:59:00.000-05:002009-03-06T01:59:00.000-05:00A modest musical interlude.<A HREF="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vouDK-LELEU" REL="nofollow">A modest musical interlude.</A>Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-36266792458958323152009-03-06T00:13:00.000-05:002009-03-06T00:13:00.000-05:00Kalinara:You're reading it right. She's also tryin...<STRONG>Kalinara:</STRONG><BR/><BR/>You're reading it right. She's also trying to control what actions = those who <EM>truly</EM> care about social justice.Avalon's Willowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07539301720154191607noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-92040801998529790462009-03-06T00:11:00.000-05:002009-03-06T00:11:00.000-05:00Twa-in-yin:Writing While White also doesn't mean y...<STRONG>Twa-in-yin</STRONG>:<BR/><BR/>Writing While White also doesn't mean you're doing it right.Avalon's Willowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07539301720154191607noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-54791398999978385372009-03-05T20:54:00.000-05:002009-03-05T20:54:00.000-05:00Aw, damnit. I really really wanted to like Ms. Be...Aw, damnit. I really really wanted to like Ms. Bear. I don't read her books (never caught my attention), but I've enjoyed her reviews of Criminal Minds and other of her posts.<BR/><BR/>But no. If I'm reading her post right, it <I>looks</I> like she's trying to call a moratorium on discussion/critique of her handling of racial issues. And that right there is the fucking epitome of white privilege.kalinarahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01417686761943716312noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-20556963211577929482009-03-05T19:30:00.000-05:002009-03-05T19:30:00.000-05:00Analysing While Brown means you're doing it wrong....<I>Analysing While Brown means you're doing it wrong. Automatically</I><BR/><BR/>Analysing While Brown does not mean you're doing it right, automatically, either.<BR/><BR/>I disliked Bear's book. However, I disagree with your criticism. I believe that has no implications other than that we disagree. (And for what it's worth, I'm Hispanic).Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-17217892278188127362009-03-05T19:06:00.000-05:002009-03-05T19:06:00.000-05:00DeepaD:I'm beginning to wonder if yours is a speci...<STRONG>DeepaD:</STRONG><BR/><BR/>I'm beginning to wonder if yours is a special kind of brown. People keep ignoring your word - well, they notice the eloquent, kind, PoC stuff. But the disagreeing stuff? Woosh, over their heads.<BR/><BR/>It kind of makes me want to dress you up in leather (can you have a leather Sari? Maybe Salwaar Kameez?) and get you to say Grrr. Maybe they'd notice then.<BR/><BR/>But you're tired now, so there's no point. Still, thanks. <BR/><BR/>I'm back to being amused and thinking of the lot of them sitting through some very boring movies - because they can't properly complain it's not for them early, and get their money back and go see something they'd actually like.Avalon's Willowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07539301720154191607noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-47944328026526626862009-03-05T19:02:00.000-05:002009-03-05T19:02:00.000-05:00Lysana:Oh... well, I've had a very recent 'Damnit ...<STRONG>Lysana:</STRONG><BR/><BR/>Oh... well, I've had a very recent 'Damnit I Feel This Way!' moment myself, so at least you've got proof I've got clay feet.Avalon's Willowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07539301720154191607noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-31760390741133957842009-03-05T19:01:00.000-05:002009-03-05T19:01:00.000-05:00Moondancerdrake:Girl you wrong! :) You made me lau...<STRONG>Moondancerdrake</STRONG>:<BR/><BR/>Girl you <EM>wrong</EM>! :) You made me laugh!Avalon's Willowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07539301720154191607noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-72959312750817139962009-03-05T18:59:00.000-05:002009-03-05T18:59:00.000-05:00Yeah, once again, for the record, I will say publi...Yeah, once again, for the record, I will say publicly that I stand by your critique of the book, Willow. <BR/>I read the whole book, I enjoyed it, and I found it problematic for racial and cultural reasons. I no longer have the energy to write out a detailed review spelling out my critique, but I stand by your reading of the issues.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-54419763183417354322009-03-05T18:41:00.000-05:002009-03-05T18:41:00.000-05:00chopchicaIf one self-satisfied white person gets a...<B>chopchica</B><BR/><BR/>If one self-satisfied white person gets attacked for being wrong about their self-assigned freedom from racism, all are attacked. It's one of those human condition reactions when you think you're being victimized. You see one of your own get poked at and it's time to circle the wagons. I used to feel like that myself under similar circumstances. Embarrassing in retrospect, but immaturity is never a nice thing to look back on. Cucumberseed also makes a valid point.<BR/><BR/>And I've just taken a longer look at Racefail '09 after being peripherally aware of it for a little while. I'm rather croggled by it all, but only by the mass quantities. Far too many of the involved parties are behaving as I'd expect. Not as individuals, but in that collective sense as I already described. I've witnessed it far too many times. Participated on the wrong side of it as well in days gone by.<BR/><BR/>I am grateful that I followed this up. It's been educational. It's shed light on both the core issues of race and its depictions in SF/F as well as enhanced my own ability to explicate the issues faced by sexual minorities. I think I'll be adding this blog to my feed on LJ to make sure I continue to see and learn.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-24379433780034262072009-03-05T18:40:00.000-05:002009-03-05T18:40:00.000-05:00I'll make them cookies...anyone got some exlax I c...I'll make them cookies...anyone got some exlax I can melt up for the batter?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-45429706940168751642009-03-05T16:31:00.000-05:002009-03-05T16:31:00.000-05:00It's like they all think that if there's no hope f...<I>It's like they all think that if there's no hope for Elizabeth Bear, the world is *doomed*.</I><BR/><BR/>This. More to the point they (catagorically including me) fear that if Bear (who worked very hard to be inclusive and sensitive and respectful - just ask her) could not pull it off with all that effort and sensitivity and respect then the rest of us will *never* be able to get away with... erm give the world our orcs and dark elves and noble savages and martial mystics and Morgan Freemanesque mentor figures who heroically give their lives, whatever else (very respectful, of course, very sensitive) NO MATTER HOW HARD WE TRY (eleventyone)and someone might call us ...<BR/><BR/>I can't even contemplate it. *shiver*<BR/><BR/>-Cucumberseed, who once did think that Bear was handling getting called out well and then learned otherwise and now looks like a damned fool for it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-35138065109555986572009-03-05T16:30:00.000-05:002009-03-05T16:30:00.000-05:00Thanks for this. Oh, and re: "But Deepad READ THE ...Thanks for this. <BR/><BR/>Oh, and re: "But Deepad READ THE WHOLE DAMN THING and none of those white jackasses will actually engage with that" -- well, you know, Analysing While Brown means you're doing it wrong. Automatically.<BR/><BR/>--illariy@LJ, who cannot work OpenIDAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-18388316055465716152009-03-05T15:43:00.000-05:002009-03-05T15:43:00.000-05:00What is with all the Elizabeth Bear worship? I ser...What is with all the Elizabeth Bear worship? I seriously don't get why people scrambled *so hard* to give her the benefit of the doubt, over and over and over. Is it really that hard to accept that she's just a giant privileged asshole (not to mention somebody who can't write a word - fiction or nonfiction - without the smug and pedantic pretentiousness dripping off the screen)? I keep seeing people being all, "well, she's the only one who came out okay during the first round!" and I mean, were they just *ignoring what she's actually said*?<BR/><BR/>It's like they all think that if there's no hope for Elizabeth Bear, the world is *doomed*.<BR/><BR/>-chopchica, attacking Elizabeth Bear et al from behind my giant white hood.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-25771120716583225682009-03-05T14:07:00.000-05:002009-03-05T14:07:00.000-05:00Lurker:Gives the label/title: "Cookie Monster" a w...<STRONG>Lurker:</STRONG><BR/><BR/>Gives the label/title: "Cookie Monster" a whole new meaning now, doesn't it.Avalon's Willowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07539301720154191607noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4506995090336963455.post-22014687252573347462009-03-05T13:56:00.000-05:002009-03-05T13:56:00.000-05:00I want a cookie. An oreo preferably. Mmmmm. Sta...I want a cookie. An oreo preferably. Mmmmm. Stale cake and lard. Also Ben & Jerrys. A nice pint of their rocky road with the yummy crunchy marshmallows. I miss self-indulgence in sugar so mu..Oh wait. You mean cookies like "rewards for trying to act like a decent, thinking person so you will keep acting like a decent, thinking person". Shoot. Now I'm all hungry...LurkerWithouthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03540770911478925992noreply@blogger.com